51 Ford

[idrivejunk]

Its not often that a next post proves out the last. Normally a good bit of contradiction is to be expected as I wade through the flow of building... but that last sentence ^^^ said it well.

Very fortunately, one of my attempts to capture a photo suitable as reference was adequate Friday and that allowed me to gather much-needed info about whats wrong on the truck.

Mike did say that I am obsessive with the tape measure and insists eyeball is king. To me, eyeball comes into play only in checking my work for precision at the end or at the start, when guess and tack is the starting point. I find it most often quite misleading in the midst of chaos.

In this case, lighting and shadows thwart eyeball efforts. In this pic, you see the bright stuff but some critical points become almost lost in all the contrast, making it impossible to evaluate. Unfortunately, in person that is no better. See?-



Get my drift? Stuff looks crooked all over the place there, if you do more than glance. In order to evaluate here, measuring then becomes the only trustworthy thing. Unless a guy was to pinstripe all relevant lines with glow in the dark paint then shut the lights off and create a grid with lasers. Yeah... naw on that.

The best method I found is to take a lot of pictures, trying like heck to aim the phone best for uniform image distortion. This one ^^^ was nicely level and purt' near centered. Adequate.

I sized it on the PC and carefully picked out and traced lines to produce a line drawing representational of whats there. From there, connected left and right sides with straight lines. Beyond that point I will not attempt to explain unless others express interest in forcing symmetry, to make a show truck from a sow's ear. Boss did not want an explanatory image and has lost hope for reaching a more desireable stopping point.

I just had to get some clue as to how far away from visual harmony I really am. Findings are that the right fender is at least involved in if not causing everything thats wrong. But the line of the leading edge I have been trying to sort out will need alteration all the way across. Latch panel included. Dang. Glad I did this.

The pic below shows the worksheet I produced for my own evaluation. The note at top is to self, to be kept as a guide for when time for correction comes. Until then it will continue looking like a stroke victim doggone it. I only wish I had the power to make things go faster and make better sense, but I had to get it this far together then do the photo and worksheet just to see how it looks now-



As artwork goes, I cannot rightly say that was fun. Necessary as can be, just not fun and definitely ugly. I don't know of better ways to accomplish this type of thing. There were positive suprises as well as negative, revealed to me while doing the worksheet. They supported the fact that I am headed in the right direction. Height of left fender, main problem. Lesser issues at latch panel end and the vertical area next to headlight. Don't envy me. Doing my best but she's a fighter.

And theres the bell Round one=over.

[kb426]

Got it.

[idrivejunk]

Cool    Of course I just re-read that and sure enough... blew it at the end by saying left fender.

Right fender is the problem. The one on the left of the page. Woops! :oops:

I do seem to be eroding.  

[kb426]

I knew what you meant.

[jaybee]

Nobody noticed the asymmetry back in the day, it was "just a truck." Or for that matter cars tend to lose their perfect shapes as the decades beat on them. It still doesn't matter if it's going to be a rat rod or clear over patina look. Try to make something really slick and finished, that changes everything. People don't just glance and walk by anymore. They start spending real time looking from every angle, comparing side by side, looking for that sort of thing.

It's just a different phase in the life of this truck, so the expectations are a lot higher.

[idrivejunk]

Bill, I did the same thing to Gary first thing about Bronco rockers. The old grey matter ain't what she used to be.

Jaybee I look at it like this: Many hours will be spent with owners  in chairs a short distance from the truck. Probably surrounded by others including friends and strangers with competitive builds and the occasional judgemental eye. I don't want the owner to ever need any bodywork excuses at a show. For the price (Which I always assume by default is bloody murder highway robbery from the way people talk but I have no clue exactly and thats what keeps us together in business) there better not be any problems like that to find with any amount of staring at. That is simply a carryover assumption / attitude from fixing wrecked luxury vehicles.

What comes from that, besides a steady stream of work, is stuff like this: I reported to boss that I didn't find any usable portions of the Bronco middle floor yesterday. He had in mind to weld up a buch of holes down in beads, clean things up, patch only where holes are and like with most jobs "keep it as small as possible". OK, I offer that style of work too. Just have to know. But I had cuts marked and was ready to hack and fab the whole thing. I have always tried to be the vehicle's advocate and push for taking the high road, but one can only sell what another wishes to buy.

Thats a lot of opinion for me to spew before lunch, let alone proofread. My intent is to support your statement. Its a matter of scale. Internet scuttlebutt would have folks believe that builds such as the F1 are what ruined SS Chevelle and GTO prices and such for everyone and are why now slant six Dart sedans are ten grand. But I fail to see the connection.

[idrivejunk]

Dear Lord!  

This job is the pits.



Now before you say they are all like that, heres the one in the next stall-



Welp, um... hey I don't feel so dejected because that guy is wrangling a horse too.

Pantera guy was in to say hey. Thinks he broke a ring. :cry: Says the pan can come off, heads too no problem. In the car. But block out means transaxle too and...    ugh.

Tagging on this little F1 dab to dangle at end of post for relevance. Scribbled from edge of bed, between putting socks on and brushing teeth. I believe we all see potential in the idea, just can't allow them kinda thoughts at this time.

[idrivejunk]

Whew, that was close. Boss caved and ordered the panel. Barely sneaking the background F1 in here. Because I know you want to see whats under that-



Well... suprise!

I would call this purt near mint.  Relatively speaking.



Don't see that very often. Looks galvanized. Even still bright in a place or two. Crazy ol rust, it has a mind of it's own, don't it? I made a quick one pass with a scuff pad then wire wheel and blew off for pic.

Who'd 'a thunk it? :? There was just a shallow layer of caked dust or sand. I will probably cut the bad rocker bottom out next. There are a few other little things to do also and I figured I might get an eye roll out of this firewall whackery...



Dadgum. What'd they do, shoehorn an FE in there?

[idrivejunk]

We got the middle and rear floor panels in, for the Bronco but another tech is taking over on that. We had gotten a right rocker too, but I decided in this case, I could just make a bottom and go on. So I did. Now I am back on the F1. Suprise, suprise! The line of thought goes like so... needing the F1's Coyote as mock up for a Coyote Bronco. Which is neither of the Broncos in this building. So if I can "fix the fender" on the F1, then the front clip can come off then that engine can come out. For that. Follow?

No worries. Here is a small bonus start to finish rocker patch job to clear your minds-














All better? Yeah the insides got slathered with black stuff.

You can see the little qwik corner piece here. Made from the tip pieces of the hood side slot mockup metal. The long pieces ended up as a picture frame.





So... I am now back to here. Started grinding this-

[jaybee]

I know the customer pays for every hour (and should,) but it amazes me the effort you you put into making little slices to move small bits of metal around in order to perfect the fit.

[idrivejunk]

I think I can show you some of the chaos with these pics, if you wish to study with me.

The spots where those corner-rounder triangle pieces from last post go are at perfectly matched height and length, and width is off less than half an inch depending on what other places are referenced. Consider those points satisfactory and pinned down.

About 3/4" difference is present, comparing wheel opening lip heights at highest point, just behind hub. I might consider that sufficient but it will change when I take the too much total height out of the right fender.

Working toward that, I find the disoriented looking gaps at ends of latch panel standing in my way. Messes up the look so bad. So here you see me wading through ideas for correcting, trying to establish who gets matched to who.



In the above pic, see green tape indicating current target gaps there. And the eyebrow tape line indicating leading edge looks alright, eh?

Well, back up and squat down, and remember height is perfect at fender tops. Let me borrow yer eyeball.



See there? My goodness, whopsided ain't it? Well, the owner says Kindig had trouble with the same spot. That means I am still in the tall cotton.


Things I can detect that are going on in that head-on view, remembering points already pinned with sufficient accuracy:

Height of fender side gap too low. Match RH to LH

Top outside corners of grille opening in body do not match. Match LH to RH fender, and LH half of leading edge on latch panel to RH.

Valance and HL mount panel flanges on lower fender corner extension panels mismatch, showing more top of valance in front and top views.



The good news is almost all of what I already did is usable within that plan. And an explanation surfaced for why the latch panel ends turned out with goofy gaps even after all I did. You'll have to go back to the top pic to see. Marks where I laid a straightedge down along the outside of the inner fenders extend forward onto the latch panel at very different angles. You may also notice one inner fender sits farther forward than the other also. This means latch panel and inner fender flanges on the fenders are not at matching angles, plus the sets of inner fender holes are not at matching lengths.

All that is OK with me, as long as the latch panel looks symmetrical with hood closed. If the end gap positions don't match, the whole front end looks wrong. Nobody had a lick of interest, as in sketch straight to trash can, in doing the modification below the leading edge.

[kb426]

I was looking at some pics of these trucks and saw a hood gap on the side that was very wide as you had mentioned. They don't all have it. My thought was the hoods are more consistent but the tops of the fenders are the problem area. Maybe because of the way the inner fender and the fender lack support in that area.

[idrivejunk]

I know the customer pays for every hour (and should,) but it amazes me the effort you you put into making little slices to move small bits of metal around in order to perfect the fit.

You already know that doing so can set the vehicle apart from the rest and thats the why, but as far as the figuring out what, or how, to-do goes...

I can tell you that a (pardon the Scrabble words) sometimes counterintuitive and often wildly disproportionate amount of caring, focus, and follow through is required. Collision repair experience might be what helps me figure how to correct, and if so that may be a rarity but my best is only an educated guess. What a guy cannot do, or is willing to pay to have done instead, is what that guy pays for. What it costs is based on how long it takes ME to do, at THIS place. Adjusted by the clever middleman boss to suit and perpetuate the conditions, of course. And we thrive nowadays on that but theres never going to be book times for old ragamuffin cars thank goodness. Of those vehicle owners who choose us and get me, I'd wager that some win and some lose. But I'd like to think the vehicle doesn't lose if I can help it. If nobody else worries me about which is which, I go at my default speed and the world continues to turn somehow.

Like I keep reminding myself, the last thing I did big build work on, to hit the streets, is four builds and that many years ago. I know I have an insecurity issue but having like 3 years' work done and not knowing if any of it was a success beyond making a living... does cross my mind from time to time. Its all still theory to me and I'll surely be more egotistical once something gets tagged. Knowing F1 man was also Biscayne man helps ease my mind. He seems pretty sharp to me.

I keep thinking the Cat will pop up one of these days. Out of sight, out of mind I reckon. Ain't seen any wheels for the A yet. :?:  

[idrivejunk]

I was looking at some pics of these trucks and saw a hood gap on the side that was very wide as you had mentioned. They don't all have it. My thought was the hoods are more consistent but the tops of the fenders are the problem area. Maybe because of the way the inner fender and the fender lack support in that area.

If I have a lick of trouble out of that, you can bet I'll template bottom curves of hood sides for comparison. Side to side but also with old hood. Then we'll know. But yeah, I also suspect lack of support and have an idea. In fairness I gotta throw in the chance that I messed it up or changed things by shaving hood sides too. Side gaps will take front burner once I think I have a straight face on her but before getting too committed up there.

Five out of six hood bumpers on it now, witnessed contact when closed as I opened the dusty hood today. Can't be too far out of range.

I wanted to ask you... or look at some web pix m'self... on 53-6 I hear something about moving crossmember to center wheels in front fender openings better. Is that...? Do I? Would they? And if? etc. The wheels do look awful far ahead, up front. Plus toed out a smidge going by IDJ eye.  I wonder did 51s have that factory looks glitch and does Roadster Shop build them which way, if so. :?  Hmm. Thots?

[idrivejunk]

Life size template tells all  :!:  This is after folding the template down the center and averaging the edges of the halves. I would just be spinning my wheels without the Bronco floor box.



The trimmings show the more obvious old side to side differences. I surrounded the template with 3/4" tape and marked a  refererence line, and am about to... deep breath.... force all panels to comply. I will probably just keep trimming the template as I work my way down. Should work, if I keep air in the tires.  



Drew something for a bud, thought you might dig it too. riiiipp :0-0