Tow Vehice

enjenjo · January 03, 2012, 04:21:02 PM

I am in the market for a newer tow vehicle. The one I have now is an E350 van, with a EFI 351, and an A4HD, 93 model. The last one was an E350 van with a Carbureted 351 and a C6. Both had a dual tire conversion on the back. Ready to tow the truck weighs about 7500 lbs. Both got about 10 to 12 MPG

So what I need is something that will tow 8000 lbsplus, for long distances, decent fuel mileage, with inside room to store stuff. I am not sold on the newer Fords, I hear of too many problems, both with gas and diesel. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

wayne petty · January 03, 2012, 05:31:25 PM

frank.... before you ditch the 93 ford van.. that can easily last 400,000 miles... with just normal once in a while repairs...

and i know that you know a LOT.

when was the last time you ran a KOEO and a KOER test.. .

i work on a LOT of EEC4 fords... if it has a code and it may NOT be one that lights the Check engine light.. it will CHOP the fuel mileage by 1/3..

if the smog pump does not create enough volume and pressure to pass the TAB TAD test.. it will back off the fuel economy.. to protect the engine and the cats.. hoping that you will fix it.. fail safe.. it looks at the oxygen sensor signals to tell if the diverter valve and pump are working properly.

everything has to work perfectly .. i am sure that you have a scan tool.. run the codes.. see what happens.. then clear the codes... it will not self clear the codes after a failure..

on my friends van.. E250.. it would do a weird chuggle when coming to a stop.. turned out when he worked on it.. he did not see the breather hose from the valve cover to the intake duct.. it allowed a 1/2" air leak between the MAF and the throttle body.. man was that hard on the fuel trim.. drove the Computer nuts as it did not have the expected maf flow at idle.. do you have a factory service manual section HC for this van.. or a mitchell drivability manual.. or online info eautorepair.net or alldatadiy.com as there are serious differences between years.. i have a 93 mitchell truck and van drivability manual if you need info..

i know that you know most of this.. i just run into this really often.. where a single small item.. will kick it into safe mode and ruin the MPG.. oh.. be sure to really hammer the throttle at the end.. so the ECM can hear the detonation sensors..

bad egr back pressure transducer are also a problem.. as are leaking egr valves.. bad diverter valves.. holes in the air injection pipes..

enjenjo · January 03, 2012, 05:51:26 PM

Wayne, the fuel mileage is not the big issue. I live in Ohio, the body on this is just about gone, all the doors are rusted out at the bottom, the rocker panels are missing, and the floor is perforated in several places. Plus, the exhaust system is bad, and the oil pan on the engine is rusted out. It has 190,000 miles on it, and needs ball joints and tie rod ends.

I'll pull the drivetrain and retire it.

wayne petty · January 03, 2012, 06:04:33 PM

Quote from: "enjenjo"Wayne, the fuel mileage is not the big issue. I live in Ohio, the body on this is just about gone, all the doors are rusted out at the bottom, the rocker panels are missing, and the floor is perforated in several places. Plus, the exhaust system is bad, and the oil pan on the engine is rusted out. It has 190,000 miles on it, and needs ball joints and tie rod ends.

I'll pull the drivetrain and retire it.

i was wondering about the Rust issue... i don't think about it out here.. as things usually don't rust out except near the beach..

i took a look at the current ford E350/E450 super duty cut away cabs.. 11 and 12 is what they get.. out here in so cal.. there are a few specialized van dealers with various deals.. one of them i have had friends deal with is http://www.famvans.com/ this is just to see what is out there.. as the have a good selection.. but then there is the truck trader magazine at the local gas station mini marts..

i was thinking.. 10 foot low cube van.. or a 14 foot low cube.. build a cabinet for a porta potty in the back.. cut some side windows.. a top vent.. but i don't know what you really need..

are you going to do something like a truck bed coating on the bottom of the replacement ..

Pete · January 03, 2012, 06:54:16 PM

Quote from: "enjenjo"I am in the market for a newer tow vehicle. The one I have now is an E350 van, with a EFI 351, and an A4HD, 93 model. The last one was an E350 van with a Carbureted 351 and a C6. Both had a dual tire conversion on the back. Ready to tow the truck weighs about 7500 lbs. Both got about 10 to 12 MPG

So what I need is something that will tow 8000 lbsplus, for long distances, decent fuel mileage, with inside room to store stuff. I am not sold on the newer Fords, I hear of too many problems, both with gas and diesel. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

I tow with a 2000 Ford diesel, F250, 2 wheel drive, 6 speed manual with a no window canopy. Built in cupboards and racks in the back etc etc.
Probably about the same weight as you with the race car and associated stuff loaded. 18 mpg on the flats.

Glen · January 03, 2012, 10:19:20 PM

When you say "newer Fords" i assume you are talking about the 6.0 and the 6.4 engines.....yes, i would stay away from them. The 6.0 is proving to be better but they still have the issue with the EGR cooler failures.
The 6.4 regen program is such a cancer on the engine and wastes fuel.

The 7.3 has proven to be a workhorse and there are some clean ones out there that the retirement community have traded in. Arizona would be a good place to get one from.....no rust. The 7.3 weak link was the transmission, update it with a 6.0 style cooler and it will save it.

I have the new 6.7L 2011 F250 and it is turning out to be the saving grace for Ford on the diesel market, awesome truck and we never see them in for service. They use the DEF fluid for the cat and Im getting about 10K miles per 5Gallon tank.

Beck · January 04, 2012, 04:21:03 PM

I rode with Hooley from his place to Bonneville for the 2010 Speed Week. Hooley had a Dodge crew cab 1 ton for the tow vehicle. It had a manual transmission. The motor was "chipped". The towing ability of this truck amazed me. I knew it had power, but wow. We didn't shift down out of overdrive going over the mountains. We were towing the Stude, a full tool box, extra parts, generator, pit equipment, you name it we had it. It pulled the mountains in high gear without a strain. These were places Hooley had been in first gear and really working with his gas Suburban.

A few years ago I was running with guys pulling garden tractors. We were using a Ford diesel that was also chipped with a manual transmission. We didn't have as much weight but it was still very impressive. We were using a 28' enclosed trailer with 4 tractors and all the support tools and equipment. There were 4 guys and gear. No strain.

My choice would be a diesel if pulling heavy loads. Chip it up and haul *. A manual transmission is a big help in my opinion. I don't pull heavy stuff so I have a gasser and am usually happy with it. There are times I cuss it because of lack of power when I hook up to the car hauler.

WZ JUNK · January 04, 2012, 06:48:39 PM

Being a junk man, this is my input for what it is worth. The mini busses or short busses that the school uses are replaced regularly. The school sells them to the high bidder and they usually go really cheap. The newer ones are diesel, automatic, with air conditioning and air brakes. I would trash the bus body and replace it with something more appropriate and take to the road in style.

John

enjenjo · January 04, 2012, 07:44:25 PM

Quote from: "WZ JUNK"Being a junk man, this is my input for what it is worth. The mini busses or short busses that the school uses are replaced regularly. The school sells them to the high bidder and they usually go really cheap. The newer ones are diesel, automatic, with air conditioning and air brakes. I would trash the bus body and replace it with something more appropriate and take to the road in style.

John

A man after my own heart. Right now I am looking at a 2002 Ford E350 ambulance, 7.3, automatic, from the south, with 155,000 miles on it.

Beck · January 04, 2012, 07:50:12 PM

Quote from: "WZ JUNK"Being a junk man, this is my input for what it is worth. The mini busses or short busses that the school uses are replaced regularly. The school sells them to the high bidder and they usually go really cheap. The newer ones are diesel, automatic, with air conditioning and air brakes. I would trash the bus body and replace it with something more appropriate and take to the road in style.

John

I like your thinking John. I have looked at small buses on government surplus sites. At the time I thought I wanted a rig to pull a pulling tractor around. I came to my senses. (My wife doesn't agree, she still thinks I'm nuts)
In the northwest they have "crew trucks" to haul firemen to remote fires. They are built on International truck chassis. The crew area has bucket seats in a box on the back of the truck. From the photos I think there were 8 seats (4 rows of 2), but there could have been 16 (4 rows of 4). Lots of storage room. Under 100k miles going for about $9k.

phat rat · January 04, 2012, 09:13:05 PM

Quote from: "enjenjo"
Quote from: "WZ JUNK"Being a junk man, this is my input for what it is worth. The mini busses or short busses that the school uses are replaced regularly. The school sells them to the high bidder and they usually go really cheap. The newer ones are diesel, automatic, with air conditioning and air brakes. I would trash the bus body and replace it with something more appropriate and take to the road in style.

John

A man after my own heart. Right now I am looking at a 2002 Ford E350 ambulance, 7.3, automatic, from the south, with 155,000 miles on it.

I was going to mention an ambulance. I've seen a few used as swap meet haulers

Glen · January 04, 2012, 09:14:37 PM

[quote="enjenjo]
A man after my own heart. Right now I am looking at a 2002 Ford E350 ambulance, 7.3, automatic, from the south, with 155,000 miles on it.[/quote]

Please take into consideration that Ambulances sit idling the entire shift. The employees run the truck when its hot for the ac and they run them in the winter for the heater. Ford has recently went to hour meters on all of their super duty lines.

enjenjo · January 04, 2012, 11:39:47 PM

Quote from: "Glen"[quote="enjenjo]
A man after my own heart. Right now I am looking at a 2002 Ford E350 ambulance, 7.3, automatic, from the south, with 155,000 miles on it.

Please take into consideration that Ambulances sit idling the entire shift. The employees run the truck when its hot for the ac and they run them in the winter for the heater. Ford has recently went to hour meters on all of their super duty lines.[/quote]

I have considered that.

sirstude · January 05, 2012, 08:37:37 AM

I know the ambulance guys here at the Hospital all think they are Parnelli Jones when they get behind the wheel. I had the supervisor ask me one day why the belts kept getting thrown on ours. It turns out, when the guys headed north on a call, they go over a pretty steep climb and then they would just put it on the floor on the down hill side. Just before the turn off to the "Gates of the Mountains" the belts would flip off. He finally had to ride with them to get the issues under control. If you go that route, I hope you keep it painted like an Ambulance

Doug

wayne petty · January 05, 2012, 12:18:50 PM

if you pick up a ex ambulance.. please .. take a clean plastic garden sprayer.. and use some hydrogen peroxide in it... then a second go round with mild bleach solution.. if you plan on removing any brackets or getting behind any cabinets close to the floor.. get rid of any dried fluids .. that might have dripped out of somebody that did not get mopped up in a normal fashion.