&#$@ Gaskets...

John · December 25, 2006, 01:27:01 AM

Quote from: "enjenjo"
Quote from: "John"The other posters are correct that rubber for a sink is likely to not be oil/gas/heat resistant. What is needed is NBR or equivalent.

Shameless pitch here, and if that is against the forum rules I apologize. I run a custom gasket business and we can help the OP or any other members needing one-off or small gasket runs. You can find out more at //www.gasketstogo.com.

John

That kind of depends John. If this is a hit and run post, then it's against the rules. If you are going to stick around and participate, then it's not. For the time being, since this is relavent, I'll leave it up.

Thanks. I do plan to participate whenever I can help with a topic, most likely gasket related of course.

enjenjo · December 25, 2006, 02:01:03 AM

OK, thanks John.

Now for a question, do you favor sealers on head gaskets, and why?

John · December 25, 2006, 02:32:23 AM

That's a good question, and a controversial one, but one that I will dodge somewhat by saying the following. The way we usually work is to reproduce a gasket from a customer supplied sample, blueprint, or template. We do that using material as close to the original as possible, or as specified by the customer. I generally refrain from offering advice on whether or not to use a sealant because there are so many variables that I may or may not know about. What I do advise is for them to follow either the OEM mfg. advice or to follow the advice of fellow enthusiasts, since they are in a far better position than I am to know the situation as far as their particular application.

I will give you an example of what I mean. I have some customers who run old Lister diesel stationary engines. Many of these are copies produced in India, and because of poor surfaces and poor gaskets on the OEM equipment they are prone to head leaks. I know from my customers that they like to spray their gaskets with copper spray, and that seems to improve things for them. We make a silicone coated composite gasket for those models that seems to have stopped the leak problems, and I don't think using a sealant is necessary. I mention this as an example of an instance where a particular 'community' has derived a consensus opinion on the suitability of using a sealant.

Finally, there is one more reason that I generally avoid taking a side on a sealant issue. Having produced a gasket to a customer's spec, if I advise one way or another on sealant use I am just increasing the possibility that any subsequent failure might be blamed on my sealant advice, whether or not that is really the case.

enjenjo · December 25, 2006, 03:14:10 AM

Thanks for the reply. It depends on the gasket if I use sealers or not. For the coated gaskets, I generally do not use a sealer. For uncoated gaskets, I use aluminum paint, and have for 40 years. I have very few gasket failures.

We are going to have to move this to a dedicated post so we can put it in the tech archives later.

Rayvyn · December 25, 2006, 09:19:09 AM

Quote from: "John"The other posters are correct that rubber for a sink is likely to not be oil/gas/heat resistant. What is needed is NBR or equivalent.

John

I would normally agree, and certainly would not have made a gasket to fit out of regular rubber, and at the time I couldn't find any of the gasket sheets at the stores. For some reason, no one had them in stock and others didn't carry it any more. But time and material restraints made this worth a try. I wasn't about to buy another whole oil filter just to get another gasket. And, I figured anything that stands up to hot coffee, hot grease, cooking oils and vinegar was a least worthy of an attempt. I may just opt for the spin on adapter just for peace of mind. Bob Paulins concern about blowout at highway speeds and pressure have me concerned.
Thanks to all for their feedback...

kb426 · December 25, 2006, 09:53:58 AM

I'm a dinosaur too. I use aluminum paint on steel and coppercoat on solid copper gaskets.

Bob Paulin · December 25, 2006, 03:06:08 PM

Quote from: "Rayvyn"
Quote from: "John"The other posters are correct that rubber for a sink is likely to not be oil/gas/heat resistant. What is needed is NBR or equivalent.

John

I would normally agree, and certainly would not have made a gasket to fit out of regular rubber, and at the time I couldn't find any of the gasket sheets at the stores. For some reason, no one had them in stock and others didn't carry it any more. But time and material restraints made this worth a try. I wasn't about to buy another whole oil filter just to get another gasket. And, I figured anything that stands up to hot coffee, hot grease, cooking oils and vinegar was a least worthy of an attempt. I may just opt for the spin on adapter just for peace of mind. Bob Paulins concern about blowout at highway speeds and pressure have me concerned.
Thanks to all for their feedback...

Are we talking about the early Chevrolet canister oil filter here?

You COULD go down to your local NAPA store and ask for an oil filter gasket with the following dimensions....

i.d. - 3.76
o.d. - 3.986
height - .125
wall thickness - .113

OR.....

....you could ask him to order one or more #5124 oil filter gaskets that are listed in the paper filter catalog....

....gaskets which come packed with the #1143 canister filters for the early Chevy V-8.

Sometimes, even stores like NAPA hire less-than-knowledgeable counter workers, so you have to often insist that they try ordering it...I go through this on a regular basis ordering brake caliper pistons with a "P" suffix (for "phenolic").

If things haven't changed in the last few years, these numbers should also be good at Carquest since they also used to sell Wix filters......one year (2001?) there was a Carquest technical bulletin page in the NAPA filter catalog.

B.P.

Rayvyn · December 25, 2006, 04:15:39 PM

Quote from: "Bob Paulin"
Are we talking about the early Chevrolet canister oil filter here?

You COULD go down to your local NAPA store and ask for an oil filter gasket with the following dimensions....

i.d. - 3.76
o.d. - 3.986
height - .125
wall thickness - .113
B.P.

Yes, the Pontiac 287 has the same canister filter as the 55 Chevy. I went to NAPA, and we went through every gasket in their catalogues. They didn't have anything with those dimensions, or any size even remotely close that I could trim myself. The only one they had came with the new filter, which I already had. They don't even have 1955 Pontiacs listed in their system, so we tried the Chevy stuff also, but no luck. I'll take the #'s with me to another store to see what they can match up. Thanks for the help...

Dave · December 25, 2006, 04:25:01 PM

i just checked advance auto and auto zone on the web here and no luck there either. How bout the new gasket guy here. You may wanna get a dozen made if the price is right. Hell maybe even more then ebay em im sure your not the only one lookin for em. Id have changed to the spin on adapter. But thats me.
Dave

Bob Paulin · December 25, 2006, 05:28:23 PM

Quote from: "Rayvyn"
Quote from: "Bob Paulin"
Are we talking about the early Chevrolet canister oil filter here?

You COULD go down to your local NAPA store and ask for an oil filter gasket with the following dimensions....

i.d. - 3.76
o.d. - 3.986
height - .125
wall thickness - .113
B.P.

Yes, the Pontiac 287 has the same canister filter as the 55 Chevy. I went to NAPA, and we went through every gasket in their catalogues. They didn't have anything with those dimensions, or any size even remotely close that I could trim myself. The only one they had came with the new filter, which I already had. They don't even have 1955 Pontiacs listed in their system, so we tried the Chevy stuff also, but no luck. I'll take the #'s with me to another store to see what they can match up. Thanks for the help...

Sounds like they are trying to find this oil filter gasket in their GASKET line....

As they say on Mythbusters, "Well....THERE's your problem!!!"

Oil filter gaskets are easiest to find in the NAPA FILTER catalog.....in the back.

According to my 2000 NAPA FILTER catalog, the correct gasket number for a '56 -'60 Pontiac with the cartridge filter is #5086....but you say you have a '55 Pontiac engine. I don't see the '55 Pontiac listed either.

IIRC, wasn't the oil filter STILL an option on the "55 Chevy? My catalog goes back to 1953 for the Corvette, but only to '56 for the Chevy.

Now, the '56 Chevy filter is a #1123 which DOES use the same #5124 gasket as a zillion other Chevies through 1967 with the cartridge filter.

The Pontiac #5086 gasket dimensions are...

i.d. - 4.00
o.d. - 4.425
height - .062
thickness - .213

....so it is really quite different from the "standard" Chevy cartridge filter gaskets - making it pretty easy for you to tell the difference.

The #1123 listed for the '56 Chevy is bigger than the later Chevy #1143 cartridge, but uses the common Chevy #5124 gasket.

The #1100 listed for the early 'Vettes is a five-inch wide canister - quite different from the common Chevy cartridge.

In spite of all the Pontiac versus Chevy stuff, it STILL sounds as though you are looking for the very common, #5124 gasket that fits virtually ALL Chevies with the cartridge filter.

Tell them they must look in the back of their paper filter catalog and use the "FIL" filter line, NOT the "NGA" Gasket line in their computer....IOW "FIL 5124".

Everything shows up as good numbers at napaonline.com

The FIL 5124 lists for 49 cents......

B.P.

Charlie Chops 1940 · December 25, 2006, 09:20:02 PM

I seem to remember that the '55 V8 filter was a canister mounted above the engine and that the block mount caniste started in '56...

Charlie

enjenjo · December 25, 2006, 09:28:47 PM

You are correct Charlie. It appears to be the same filter housing as a Six, but with a different bracket welded on it..

Also, some 56 engines still had the remote filters, my guess is until the older blocks ran out.

I owned a factory 57 with a 265 one time. The engine was painted chartreuse

Rayvyn · December 26, 2006, 07:51:51 AM

Quote from: "Charlie Chops 1940"I seem to remember that the '55 V8 filter was a canister mounted above the engine and that the block mount caniste started in '56...

Charlie

It did have the old oil bath air cleaner on it at one time, but the oil filter canister is indeed a block mount, on the lower rear portion of the passenger side of the block. The top canister piece (the hat) bolts directly to the block. I looked to see if it was a remote one or something that was welded up. I have a service book for the car, and it shows a lower block mount for the 55. I'll see if I can get a pic of it later.