What are you doing today?

[UGLY OLDS]

Frank, compression, fuel, spark. What's missing?

Getting it all together at the right time as far as I can tell.

Spinning the engine backwards to start it, instead of reverse rotation?

Same starter as was on it before. It does turn too slow to suit me, it's a Chinese rebuild.

Which side of TDC are you checking timing from . could you be checking your timing on the wrong side of TDC. What is the firing order with reverse rotation. could you be firing the plug just after bdc on exhaust stroke when firing order is reversed.That might give you a firing with no compression and not much if any pop. What is this engine going in to.

I verified the timing marks with a piston stop, it's within a degree or so. I've tried it both ways in case it's marked wrong. The firing order is 18456273. I'll go over there today with some more test equipment, and see if I can figure it out. It was hard to tell since it was cranking so slow, but it appears that the timing is all over the place when cranking. I converted it back to points to try and eliminate any electronic problems, but got no where.

It's in an 18 ft ski boat.

I thought about the wrong firing order, but it should at least pop back through the carburetor now and then. I am grasping at straws at this point. I have a feeling it is something simple I am overlooking, but for the life of me, I don't know what it is.

  Frank ..
 The correct firing order for a 351 W Ford should be :  1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8

HOWEVER...   Verify EXACTLY what the camshaft  installed in the engine is from .. Some aftermarket cams ( Crane --Crower--Elgin--Etc ) use either firing order as they see the camshaft as "universal" ....

Small block ford camshafts will interchange between the regular 289/302 & the 351W .. All you do is change the firing order ....

The only difference is that the 302HO & 351 W use 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8 for the firing order & the regular 289/302 engines use 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8..

  I found this ..Hope it helps ...

 289 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8
302 (Pre-82) 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8
5.0 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8
5.0 HO 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8
5.0 Truck 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8
351 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8


Firewall
4 8
3 7
2 6
1 5
Front bumper


Jus' tryin'.....  

Bob ....  

[enjenjo]

Bob, this is a reverse rotation boat motor. The 18456273 is the correct  firing order according to several sources.

I found out today that the owner bought the boat with the engine torn apart. My question was why, so I got in touch with the previous owner. It seems the boat would quit running at random, cranked slow, and was hard to start. He had it towed to a marina several times. It also kept overheating, which is why the engine was disassembled. So, it seems I have to fix those problems, before I can start the motor.

[Crosley.In.AZ]

Bob, this is a reverse rotation boat motor. The 18456273 is the correct  firing order according to several sources.

I found out today that the owner bought the boat with the engine torn apart. My question was why, so I got in touch with the previous owner. It seems the boat would quit running at random, cranked slow, and was hard to start. He had it towed to a marina several times. It also kept overheating, which is why the engine was disassembled. So, it seems I have to fix those problems, before I can start the motor.

ah, the bucket of bolts just got larger.


as you mentioned, the "simple chit" will get you when it is right in front of you. May be a few simple items adding up to a larger problem.

[kb426]

Frank the first three items sound like weak voltage or a loose connection. What kind of cooling system is there? Is it open flow or a contained system? Do you think the overheating was caused by retarded ignition or did you see mechanical items that contributed? How about a timing chain that was wore out and jumped a link? I know that because you didn't tear it down, everything is conjecture.

[chimp koose]

in a boat I would wonder about proper grounds.

[BFS57]

Hello;
Far be it for me to give my humble opinion but I would be suspect that the distributor may be "part" of the problems plaging this situation.
Just my 2 cents worth.

Bruce
P.S. have a lovely day on the water :oops:

[UGLY OLDS]

Bob, this is a reverse rotation boat motor. The 18456273 is the correct  firing order according to several sources.

I found out today that the owner bought the boat with the engine torn apart. My question was why, so I got in touch with the previous owner. It seems the boat would quit running at random, cranked slow, and was hard to start. He had it towed to a marina several times. It also kept overheating, which is why the engine was disassembled. So, it seems I have to fix those problems, before I can start the motor.

 Oops ....Sorry ...I thought that it started as a reverse rotation engine & was converted to a "normal" rotation configuration ....

My Bad ... :oops:

Bob ...

[Arnold]

Frank, compression, fuel, spark. What's missing?

Getting it all together at the right time as far as I can tell.

Spinning the engine backwards to start it, instead of reverse rotation?

Same starter as was on it before. It does turn too slow to suit me, it's a Chinese rebuild.

Which side of TDC are you checking timing from . could you be checking your timing on the wrong side of TDC. What is the firing order with reverse rotation. could you be firing the plug just after bdc on exhaust stroke when firing order is reversed.That might give you a firing with no compression and not much if any pop. What is this engine going in to.

I verified the timing marks with a piston stop, it's within a degree or so. I've tried it both ways in case it's marked wrong. The firing order is 18456273. I'll go over there today with some more test equipment, and see if I can figure it out. It was hard to tell since it was cranking so slow, but it appears that the timing is all over the place when cranking. I converted it back to points to try and eliminate any electronic problems, but got no where.

It's in an 18 ft ski boat.

I thought about the wrong firing order, but it should at least pop back through the carburetor now and then. I am grasping at straws at this point. I have a feeling it is something simple I am overlooking, but for the life of me, I don't know what it is.

  Cranking vacuum.Got me once..sorry..I don't recall..timing..have you verified a timed spark.Got me once too when I finally diiscoverred that the new dist. had a broken/chewed up drive pin. Kept moving. It was jammed and I can't believe it kept working..turning..
 Degreed? Been beat by a wrong balancer/slipping balancer ring..even by a wrong cover haha.   I have been beat a lot..

[phat46]

Had a very nice evening yesterday, we were celebrating our 40th wedding anniversary and since my daughter and son in law were in town visiting from N.C. We invited them and our older daughter to go with us. When we got to the restaurant our son in law announced that the three of them were paying for dinner and there was no arguing about it. They got champagne and toasted us and insisted on dessert too. Great evening that ended too soon.  

[BFS57]

Hello;
Sounds like a great 40th Anniversery! Especially that you didn't have to reach for that wallet!
Happy 40th!

Bruce

[UGLY OLDS]

Hey ...Happy 40TH .... Congrats ... Good on the Kids for picking up the tab...

Bob...

 

[chimp koose]

Congrats on your 40th !

[Crosley.In.AZ]

Congrats on the 40th anniversary!  The years seem to go by quickly.

Our 42nd is on monday

[chimp koose]

went to a swap meet first thing this morning.Then I went to our schools car show. This was the best attended show we have had in the 6 years that its been run. There was a 500 caddy powered 27T coupe there belonging to a guy I attended high school with.He wants to trade me the shiny repro parts he has for my rusty stuff . Gee glad to help out. I will probably be getting door handles, visor and windshield brackets in trade for my seasoned parts.

[Glen]

How a car guy does home improvement:

The arched I beams are 14" tall and the post I beams are 6x6.  The J bolts are 1" and the cross bars on top are 2x4's that are capped on the ends







you might recall I have the big gates to match: