A refresher on a points ignition, please..

[32 Chevy]

Well , yesterday I picked up the newest project, a 1957 Willys 4X4 pickup. It's a pretty cool truck, all original from it's working life at the apple orchard . She came from the dry Eastern Washington country and although sports the dents and dings you would expect from a truck that spent 50 years on a farm the steel is in great shape. Even the floorboards are solid.

Under the hood is the mighty 6 cylinder Hercules flathead 6 backed up by a 4 speed non  synchro first gear and an intimidatng 3 shift levers protruding from the center tunnel.  

So now the question. I hjave become so spoiled by electronic ignitions that I would like a confirmation of a starting problem; If it matters, this is a 6 volt system. This is definitely NOT a fuel problem. There is no spark to the plugs.  

If it has been sitting for a long time , like 24 hours, it will start and run for about 30 seconds and die. Then it will not start again. It is getting plenty of fuel! I get spark to the points ( I installed new points, condenser and coil ) and can see the low tension spark at the points when cranking. However there is no spark to the plugs. This would mean the coil is bad, but I just replaced it.  

So if the coil, points, and condenser are new, the timing is correct, the fuel flow is good, why does it start, then die, and not start again?

Thanks,
DaveR

[enjenjo]

Shorted points, bad wire to the points, ie. broken inside, carbon tracked cap or rotor, that about it for now.

[32 Chevy]

Shorted points, bad wire to the points, ie. broken inside, carbon tracked cap or rotor, that about it for now.

I jumped the wire from the coil to the points, and have good low tension spark at the points when cranking. I cleaned the inside of the cap, and filed the rotor and cap contacts. No sign of carbon tracking.

[Dave]

Have you got a meter that you could hook up and make sure the 6volts to the coil is always there? Could be sumpin else causing a voltage loss. Also i have had condensers do strange things new and old. Also coils.. If you have a motors manual it should tell you how to check the coil and condensor. Might not be a bad idea even if they are new. The weiderst thing i ever had happen was on  a snowmobile. It wouldnt start on both cylinders.. only 1 so after i drove around the house for about 10 minutes it would run on both. seems moisture got in the condensor on 1 side and it had to dry out before it would run  :?:
Dave

[Mikej]

Do you have 6 volts to the coil with the key in the run position?

[32 Chevy]

Do you have 6 volts to the coil with the key in the run position?

Yes, my meter reads a full 6 volts on the positive  terminal of the coil with the key in run position. And I can visually see the low tension spark at the points when i crank it with the cap off. But no spark to the plugs. The wire from the coil to the cap is good, too.

Dave

[model a vette]

Do you get spark at the center post of the coil? If you do then the problem is farther down the line i.e. dist cap, rotor, wires, plugs in that order.

[Pep]

Take the dizzy completely out and have a good visual inspection...gears, centifugal plate, ground wire etc. Also, it is a 6v coil you replaced it with? Try a 12v coil and a 12v battery. Something may be dragging the battery voltage down after a short time running.

[32 Chevy]

Take the dizzy completely out and have a good visual inspection...gears, centifugal plate, ground wire etc. Also, it is a 6v coil you replaced it with? Try a 12v coil and a 12v battery. Something may be dragging the battery voltage down after a short time running.

O.K., I think I got it but ccant confirm until tomorrow. To check spark at the plugs I had pulled plug and laid it on the head with high tension lead atached and cranked it over. No spark. But tonight, when it started to get dark, I saw a tiny flash deep inside the plug. So I did the screwdriver between the plug wire/ ground test, and sure enough a spark jumped across the gap. So evidently the plugs became so fouled by the farmer that it just quit running. The plugs look carbon black but not bad enough to think they would be graounding out through the elctrode.

Back to basics  ...

Thanks,
Dave

[48ford]

Hpe you found it,If not get another condencer,I had one give me fits. We all know new parts can't be bad
Russ

[32 Chevy]

Well, now it gets interesting... I put in the new plugs and it started instantly, then died in about 20 seconds. Wouldn't start again but now it had good spark.

I pulled the center plugs, closest to the carb on an inline 6 and the plugs were soaked. So today's project is to disassemble the tiny one barrel carb and look for a stuck float or internal leak. Anyone have a rebuild kit for a 57 Willys 1 bbl carb? The truck has been sitting for about 6 months before I got it so something could have wrong in the carb, too.

Thanks for the ideas and keep 'em coming..
Dave

[46 fordpickup]

if you are going to get a rebuild kit [if you can find one] be carefull i was told by a rebuilder that old kits would only work well for a short time because the newer gasoline would eat away at anything rubber in the kit eg. accelerator pump.Good luck .

[32 Chevy]

It turns out that this carb was used in innumerable applications from fords falcons to the entire jeep line and plenty of other. I got a new rebuild kit from Autozone for about $13.00.

The good news is that the trusty flathead 6 runs now like a swiss watch. The idle is unbelievably smooth and she accelerates like a bullet right to redline at 3,000 RPM. Problem resolved!
Thanks!

Dave

[GPster]

Under the hood is the mighty 6 cylinder Hercules flathead 6 backed up by a 4 speed non  synchro first gear and an intimidatng 3 shift levers protruding from the center tunnel. DaveR

Only 3,000 RPM? you need to get together with Leon. He's dealing with a Honda engine that he feels is good for 11,000 RPM and he's looking for a transmission to put behind it. That many levers might get confusing at speed though. Not to mention "double-clutching"!       GPster