new project

[papastoyss]

Went yesterday & picked up a '57 Chevy 150 Handyman wagon.Has no rust in external body panels, needs floor repair, don't know yet if will need complete pan or just sections.Old drag car, some yahoo cut out the rear wheel wells to resemble a '55 nomad except much rougher.Saber saw cut then flared out w/vise grips. Plans are 5.3 or 6.0 LS /4l60e. Does anyone know what is a good choice for steering upgrades (PS) , its a manual steer/3 on the tree. I like power rack but the available kits are pricey ,esp for a retired guy.

[enjenjo]

here is a conversion of a 605 box using some 57 pieces  http://www.trifive.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83  here is another one  http://www.carnut.com/specs/steering/pwr605.html

Also some of the late 90s jeep Cherokee has a 605 box with a long pitman shaft, that might work too with the right bracket Here is a link to some pictures of one for installation on a ford  http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=377962

[jaybee]

Wow, great info on the Jeep box. Those should be fairly easy to come by although potentially would require some backyard engineering and frame mods depending on the dimensions of the unit.

For quite a number of years the modified 605 box was THE way to do it. Tons of cars with 605s were built and the modification isn't that difficult.

The main complaint about them is overly touchy steering. Some users hate them, others are just fine. It's my belief this is a combination of the very light steering that was once a common goal of power steering systems combined with the very small caster settings needed to make manual steering work in a 50's car. You'll want to use as much caster as you can get into one of these cars with modern tires anyway, which requires some minor changes to the suspension. You can gain caster using offset upper control arm shafts.  https://www.performanceonline.com/1955-57-CHEVY-BELAIR-210-150-OFFSET-UPPER-CONTROL-ARM-CROSS-SHAFT-EACH-UCS5557S/  You can also cut all the welds connecting the spring hat to the frame EXCEPT FOR THOSE AT THE REAR OF THE HAT, push the hat outward at the front edge as far as it will go (it will hit a bump in the frame rail that will stop it from going farther) and weld it back in place.

Partly as a result of overly sensitive steering complaints several companies now offer bolt in steering boxes with higher effort spool valve torsion bars that offer less assist. They're a good option but as always you're trading dollars for ease of installation and lack of needed backyard engineering.  http://www.classicchevy.com/assets/pdf/classicchevy/53-231.pdf

Rack and pinion units are out there but probably aren't an ideal solution. Compare the front wheel centerline to engine relationship of one of these cars to a later car. The #1 spark plug on your car will just about line up with the axle centerline. Chevys of only a few years later will line up the axle centerline around the center of the engine. as a result there's limited room between the rear steer center link runs through a limited space between the oil pan and the front crossmember...a space where it's very difficult to fit a rack. Lowering the rack to get it out of that space can put it uncomfortably close to the ground, compromise the bump steer, or both. Oh, and most rack conversions also suffer from larger turning circle unless they also come with shorter steering arms.

[jaybee]

Following up on Enjenjo's Jeep tip I found some pics of a 99-04 Jeep Grand Cherokee box. It's almost exactly the same drop from the body of the box to the point where the pitman arm mounts which means it'll mount up to the frame easily. Length along the steering column axis is a little harder to determine since the tri5 doesn't use a rag joint. To the end of the housing it's about 2 1/2-2 3/4 longer than the stock box. I'd be interested to know your thoughts about how much room that leaves for a rag joint.

At first blush this looks like a really promising swap.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachments/general-4x4-discussion/308362d1181181573-wj-grand-cherokee-steering-box-eb-6-6-07-007.jpg

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachments/general-4x4-discussion/308362d1181181573-wj-grand-cherokee-steering-box-eb-6-6-07-007.jpg

[jaybee]

Ummmm, just going back and I realize this box has the pitman arm to the rear, for a front steer configuration. Won't this be backward for a rear steer chassis?

[enjenjo]

Ummmm, just going back and I realize this box has the pitman arm to the rear, for a front steer configuration. Won't this be backward for a rear steer chassis?

Move the Pitman arm so it points forward, and it becomes a rear steer. The Pitman arm will fit every 90 degrees.

I have done power conversions on a couple tri 5s where the owner wanted to use the stock column. So I used a coupling splined for the steering box, and welded itto the steering shaft. Then turned a Delrin bushing that fits the UD of the coupling, and press it into the column at the bottom.

[BFS57]

Hello;
Just had my 57 converted to Power Steering by putting in a 500 box from CPP. Man, should have done that a very long time ago!! Also added to my "pre-shortened" column did the new turn signal switch,upper shaft bearing, and new retro 15" steering wheel! Car turns on a dime! can sit still and turn the wheels left and right with minimum effort!!! Can't say enough about this modification!! This box is wider than the original but still had room, though changing plugs on that side may be a bit of a challenge!

Bruce

[papastoyss]

I don't intend to use the stock column. I have a couple of '70s van tilt columns laid back, will probably use one of these. The 605 box conversion seems like the lowest $ way to go, but I don't want a steering feel too light or touchy, I've been there/done that.The so called 500 box also looks promising, anybody have any experenience (sp) w/it? I still would prefer a pwr rack but it looks like extensive oil pan mods will be required with an ls engine.

[papastoyss]

Hello;
Just had my 57 converted to Power Steering by putting in a 500 box from CPP. Man, should have done that a very long time ago!! Also added to my "pre-shortened" column did the new turn signal switch,upper shaft bearing, and new retro 15" steering wheel! Car turns on a dime! can sit still and turn the wheels left and right with minimum effort!!! Can't say enough about this modification!! This box is wider than the original but still had room, though changing plugs on that side may be a bit of a challenge!

Bruce

Does your '57 have headers or stock manifolds ? I've looked at a few w/what looks like the 500 box & it looks plenty tight w/center dump manifolds.

[BFS57]

Hello;
605 Boxes may be the cheapest way to go but are notorious for leaking!
I had leaks with this install only because I used what appeared to be a fine but used PS pump only to have to switch it out!
No, I do not have headers just rear dump exhaust. I know what you mean but there are a certain brand that don't have to be "adjusted" to fit.
I used to really like to drive the 57, now, I love to drive it even it doesn't have AC (coming soon to a chevy near me!)

Bruce

[jaybee]

Move the Pitman arm so it points forward, and it becomes a rear steer. The Pitman arm will fit every 90 degrees.

Thanks. Somehow I just couldn't visualize it correctly when I asked the question but you're right. I had it pictured like a r&p mounted in the wrong position and it just isn't so.

The Jeep box looks like it has great potential for installations like this that have a pitman arm dropping down the inside of the frame, and they can be had used for not a lot of cash.

The 500 boxes have a great reputation and I'm sure it's well deserved...just a matter of what you want and how you get it I suppose.